"Stafford is a more gifted passer than Sanchez"- Ross Tucker

that was my point, you can't really know yet. Sanchez played terrible through some of the season but had a pretty good team around him. Stafford doesn't have a very good team and thus his mistakes become more glaring because of the win-loss disparity between the two QB's.

I certainly hope Sanchez turns out to be the better QB, but that won't be known for a few more seasons.

 

The question should be Revis OR an elite pass rusher. Revis is the only shut down CB in the NFL, and Nnamdi is probably in that category too. I don't consider any other CB's on that level.

I'd rather have an elite pass rusher over CB's not named Revis or Aso.

 

That's not really a fair comparison as Revis is a better CB than Allen is a DE. But I think most coaches would rather have a stud DE than a stud CB. Games are won and lost in the trenches, it's a cliche but it's true. Revis is amazing, but if a QB has all day to throw then he'll either:

A) Simply find someone else open, and Revis' impact on the play will be negated.

B) Wait for the man Revis is covering to get open. Revis is great, but he's not infallible. If you put Revis on Moss, but give Brady 5 seconds in the pocket then you're going to see some passes completed.

A stud DE is a player you can build your defense upon in many ways. You know blocking schemes will often double him, so you can plan your stunts and blitzes accordingly. Sacks are more valuable to the game than pass defended. I forget the exact numbers, but the NFL Network cited that on a drive with a sack you have an 11% chance to score. If there is a pass defended you still have about a 33% to score (if memory serves me correctly).

As a QB it's far easier to simply look to your other receiving options then it is to face constant pressure (and punishment) from a stud pass-rusher. After Super Bowl 42 Brady said the problem he faced was that the Giants were getting pressure without having to blitz and "when you can get pressure without having to take guys out of coverage, that's the best kind of defense."

In response to the "it's easy to find pass-rushers" comment, it also isn't impossible to find DBs that can cover for 2.5 seconds while the opposing QB is facing pressure and doesn't have a clean pocket to work with.

The bottom line is that a great pass-rusher is a factor on every passing play and many running plays. A great corner is only a factor in passing plays that go his way (there are plays designed without the #1 WR as the #1 read) and, ideally, shouldn't be a factor on many running plays. Methinks you are being a bit biased. This is forgivable but not exactly accurate.

 

lol touched a nerve perhaps?

I have always thought Marino was just as good as our Ken O'Brien. But our O-line couldn't protect O'Brien and he got sacked over and over and over. Much like what happened to Carr in Houston.

 

You can find plenty of examples of physically gifted player working out well (Elway being a great example) and you can find plenty of examples of gifted players not working out well (insert Jamarcus Russel joke here). Conversely, you can find plenty of physically average QBs having great success (Montana) and you can find physically average QBs failing (too many to count). What's the point you're trying to make?

 

Reverse your scenario and it works just as well if not better. I want my elite pass-rushers making up for good (not elite) CBs. Hell, the Giants secondary when they beat the Pats in the Super Bowl were average at best. The Ravens' defenses (constantly successful) haven't had any amazing corners recently. In Super Bowl 38 the Patriots had their top 2 CBs out and started Asante Samuel (as a rookie), Randall Gay, and Earthwind Moreland. Their stellar pass-rush made up for it.

 

We can argue which is more important until the cows come home. I think what's really important is that a defense has some great players on it SOMEWHERE and has a coach that knows how to leverage that greatness to give the most benefit to the defense. Rex has shown the ability to field a top notch defense with or without great corners, but he always had great players to work with.

 

Sanchez is more of a "natural" at QB. If you've seen both of them play, you know what I mean. One thing he has to work on is his clockwork. Meaning that he has to know where he's going with the football from the start of the play and get it there on time.

Stafford has superior arm strength to almost every QB in the league. He has a rocket. Besides trying to force a completion, Stafford's biggest weakness is his stiffness in the pocket. While he can occasionally run for a 1st down or get out of the pocket, he is stiff in his drop and doesn't have very good footwork that allows him to avoid pressure or get into a better position to throw the football.

It's hard to compare the two QBs because they are two different breeds. Stafford is the gunslinger type with the rocket arm. Sanchez is the more athletic type that can keep a play alive with his feet. Between the two I would say that Sanchez has the higher upside because I see him finding it easier to fix his mistakes which have more to do with experience than Stafford whose mistakes just have to do with his natural, physical stiffness.

 

Here's what I believe about "this scheme" and Rex Ryan. His scheme is amoebic - exploiting his players' strengths, whatever they may be, to maximize the effectiveness of the defense. If we didn't have Revis, but had a dynamic pass rusher I think he'd maximize the potential of that dynamic pass rusher to make the defense play at a very high level.

 

I think the difference of where the talent is on the Jets and Ravens defenses and how Rex has been successful with both is a testament to his intelligence and versatility as a defensive play-caller. In Baltimore he devised a system to let his amazing safety roam free and his intimidating MLB flow to the ball. In NY he has a system of blitzes that take advantage of Revis' abilities while also making up for a questionable pass-rushing ability. It's really very impressive on Ryan's part.

 

I completely agree with this. I actually watched almost every Vikings game last year, and although I don't think Jared Allen is as good at DE as Revis is at CB, Jared Allen took over a couple games last year and totally changed them. Most notably the GB games where he was just a monster.

Plus the Revis factor is wasted on many teams, where as a great DE always has an effect. What I mean by this is that, Revis only maximizes his impact against teams that have an elite WR. What happens when you play a team like Miami last year with no talent at WR? Revis takes away the #1 option, but if the option is someone like Hartline or Ted Ginn, then how much of an impact did he really have on the game?

I would much rather have an elite pass rusher over an elite CB.

 

I honestly don't care if Stafford turns out to be better than Sanchez. I actually hope he turns the Lions around. We definitely weren't trading up to get him, so it's not like we may have missed out on someone.

 

I think Stafford is definitely a more gifted "passer" than Sanchez. Doesn't mean he will be a better quarterback or be a better winner. Dan Marino was a better passer than Joe Montana, but who would you have rather had to win a Super Bowl?

And about the corner vs. pass rusher argument, I think it's a given that you'd rather have an elite pass rusher if all things were equal. But I think Revis is just so much better at his position than any pass rusher in the league right now is at theirs, which makes it more difficult to choose. But in general, a guy like Demarcus Ware is more valuable than a shut down corner. Look at Asomugha, he's been rendered pretty useless over there in Oakland cuz the rest of the D is crap.

 

exactly

(flr)

 

He said passer, not QB, and that is the whole point of this thread.

Yes, in general pass rusher is more important than CB, but like MikeHoncho said, Revis skews the scales.

 

I remember mentioning Jared Allen as one of the players i thought was a better defender than Revis and was called a troll for it. Funny this article mentions Both players.

 

1) You're an idiot for comparing a CB to a DE.

2) The article isn't comparing the two players but the two positions.

3) You're still a troll.

 

Its like comparing John Elway with Joe Montana.

Elway was the more gifted passer...but Montana always found a way to win.