I fall to see how playing in Giants stadium is causing the losing. Jets have good practice facilities and good locker rooms. They are not lacking for revenue and appear to be spending plenty of money. So why,? Sent from my SM-T710 using Tapatalk
Phil Simms wasn't what you'd call "Great" QB. Now we think that Simms was a HoF quality QB, but he was almost cut in his early years - that lasted for some time.
No one was afraid of us after dismantling the Cards because: A) That game was in week 4, B) We were only 2-2 after winning it, and C) No one knew the Cards (who only ended up 8-8, anyway) would go on a flukey run to the Superbowl. However, people were afraid of us after we dismantled the undefeated Titans to go 8-3. And the collapse that ensued still hurts me as much as anything Jets related.
Dude, you are delusional and clueless. You deserve to have to watch the Rich Kotite-coached Jets and the Jets of Rex's last 2 years for the rest of your life. Mangini had lost the team. There was NO WAY he could have been kept. Rex had more than worn out his welcome. He brought about his own downfall, but he NEVER was the great coach you claim he was. His first two seasons he had a great team that Mangini had put together with solid veteran leadership and character. Rex got the bump that players' coaches always do when they follow a repressive, strict disciplinarian. THAT, some new blitzes, (and luck) are what got Rex to two consecutive AFCCGs. Rex then proceeded to dismantle those two teams and the rest of the NFL caught up with Rex's blitzes and he had nothing else.
If Mangini had loosened up his micromanaging, high school tactics that he employed with the jets players he would have been the HC the jets could have kept for a long time. He and MT put together a team that was built from the trenches outward. Too bad Woody didn't interfere then an asked him to relax a bit. Your right he lost the team and was fired even after a 9-7 season. The players hated him!!
Yeah, and I don't think at that point that even if he had relaxed and eased up that he would have gotten the players back on his side. It's too bad.
How did Mangini lose the team? There weren't nearly the rumblings that there have been in Bowles two year tenure as head coach. I hated the way Mangini would shell up his defense into prevent defenses only up by one score with ten minutes left, but I thought he was a good coach and had a good eye for talent. He whiffed on Gholston but he also brought this team Brick, Mangold, Revis, Harris, Dustin Keller, Brad Smith, Leon, Dwight Lowery, Drew Coleman, etc. whom were all contributors, along with adding good vets in Calvin Pace, Tony Richardson, Thomas Jones, Kris Jenkins, etc. He tried way too hard to be New England South/Belichick Jr. and it annoyed this town so much that he got ran out of town. It's no secret that the draft talent and quality free agent signings dried up after he was fired and we just started making some awful fucking roster moves. Rex seemingly 'needed' to go as well, but the Idzik/Rex pairing was a disaster together from the start. You can't force two guys with different philosophies to try to work together. GM & head coach need to 100% be on the same page. They were not and it lead to both of their demises. Rex's blitz schemes dried up as he lost his elite corners to make it work and refused to adjust to the roster he had. When he finally did start playing cover 2 and more coverage in 2014 at the end of the season, the defense wasn't great but it looked much better. It also seemed obvious that he was DYING to start Michael Vick all year; a player he always loved in his prime, and was not a fan of Mornhinweig and his air raid type of offensive philosophy. Even still, Rex Ryan coaches a good football team. When he has middle of the pack talent, his teams are setup for a win-loss-win-loss type of season with immense ups and downs because of how fired up he gets his guys to go beat New England or other contenders which sucks the wind out of them when they play the Browns and Bears. Look at his season this year. Look at the 2013 Jets. Sorry for the essay. A bit of a synopsis on the previous two Jets coaches.
good write up, the only things i hold against mangini was not being flexible enough to find a spot for vilma in his D and insisting d rob play nt in his 3-4. the guy knew what he knew and wouldn't budge from it ,but like you said, he had an eye for talent. a little adjustment in his approach and he could have been a good coach
Mangini was fired coming off a winning season....most ppl were surprised to see him go. Players hated him, no doubt. I for one didn't care for him either and thought Rex as a breath of fresh air.
I agree. I can let Robertson go because he wasn't a very good player in general. No excuse for Vilma though as a good instinctual linebacker can play in any scheme if he's protected. Lawrence Timmons comes to mind as an undersized 4-3 WLB (Will) in college that excelled as a 3-4 inside backer for years (although somewhat different as that's the only position he knew as a pro). I'm shocked he hasn't gotten another chance in the league, or tried to transition into some sort of scout or director of player personnel. Mangini must be a real mega-douche to work with, and I think his snitching on spygate hurt him a ton in the long run as someone whom can't be trusted. Rex being fired is the best thing to ever really happen to him as it forced him to not be so stubborn at least this year. It looked like a disaster from the onset as he forced his 3-4 scheme on Mario Williams, Dareus and Hughes (who combined to make the best 4-3 front 4 in football under Schwartz). They seemed to have adjusted nicely, but we'll see how it plays out next year when he likely loses one of his top man to man corners in Gilmore next year. Amazing how he even in his down years with the Jets and a so-so offensive cast in Buffalo, he still always had a top rushing unit in the league.
robertson gets a bit of a bum wrap because of his draft status,imo. herm got a few good years out of him. him playing in that mangini 3-4 along with the knee problem that should have stopped us from drafting him was his biggest problems. although he was never the bowling ball with knives bradway promised us
Hindsight is always fun. Imagine having Troy Polamalu and Charles Tillman or Larry Johnson and Asante Samuel in the 4th instead of Robertson for that decade.
Mangini was completely inflexible and unimaginative, as you pointed out. Talent had to adapt to him, not the other way around. He added nothing as a 'defensive mind'.......with the D underperforming much more so than even this current group. He was also disliked by the players. They weren't motivated, never bought in, and absolutely folded up shop at the first sign of adversity. in short, they wouldn't play for him. ....and that was just his mistakes here, he was even more pig headed in his approach at Cleveland. I'd say there was more than a little adjustment needed there. He was the worst of our coaches this century......but Bowles is quickly threatening that title!
My coaches rank since I've been watching the Jets: Parcells Ryan Michaels Edwards Parcells, Edwards, Michaels, and Ryan at least brought positives to the table, and all had playoff results......Rex without even the benefit of a decent QB. I was very young during the Michaels days, just getting into football and hooked on the Jets. He was a very good coach for us in retrospect. Ewbanks was before my day, but obviously would be #1 otherwise. It's a very forgettable list after that. Carroll Groh Walton Coslet Bowles Mangini Kotite Carroll and Groh only had 1 year, both of which were unspectacular. Walton was the first coach i can remember wanting fired, but it actually got worse from there in the 90's with Coslet and Kotite. Mangini was terrible, and Bowles looks to be following that same path. Out of them all, I might be most disappointed with Bowles. Thought he would bring a lot more to the D than he has, and thought the players would respond to him. Was wrong on both counts ;(
His defense tied for 7th in 3rd down % at 36%, and ranked 6th in points/game in 2006. Despite a terrible 2007, we still ranked around middle of the pack in pts/game allowed and similarly in 2008. I agree in that he was stubborn and his players obviously hated him. I think he could've developed into a better coach than he's ever given credit for. It's not always a popularity contest with players if you're winning games. Players respond to winning, regardless of the style. Still, he was 23-25 as our head coach and essentially built Rex's title game rosters for him. The talent got worse and worse every year after Mangini left. Like I said though; Mangini must be a giant douchebag to work with being excommunicated from the NFL before he turned 44. He's the type of guy, in my opinion, that would've become an excellent head coach if given more time to grow. You, along with the rest of the NFL strongly disagree so maybe I'm wrong, lol. I liked him a lot more than Bowles, who seemingly brings next to nothing to the table and seems to refuse to learn the offensive aspect of the game. That's where Rex has grown. I hope Bowles learns that being a head coach can't just mean a glorified defensive coordinator.
I had no problems with his conservative approach on defense, Bellicheat has been using the bend but don't break his whole career as a HC, forces the opposition to be perfect every time they posses the ball. Like you stated, it was his inflexibility that became his undoing, and yes, his days in Cleveland were worse, covering the mural of Jim Brown, seriously man, the greatest RB in the history of the league and Mangini disrespected the team and their history with that move.
i think that was more a product of him forcing players to his scheme then his scheme itself. the guy has a football mind, his personality is what held him back. he is like the anti tom coughlin,he couldn't adjust to what the team needed. coughlin with the jags, a very young team, was a task master. he saw that didn't work with the giants, adjusted, and success.those teams 2006-2008 were full of high character guys who didn't need the strict no nonsense coach he was being. i think if lightened up it would have went far enough with the team to keep him around longer. who knows how the team would have looked. i know i trust tanny and mangini in the war room more than any combination we have had since. i agree with your list and have seen about the same coaches you have. the first firing i celebrated was joe walton
