The reason the Jets are losing is that we are losing the battle on the Offensive and Defensive Lines. We are constantly being pushed back on both lines - and few if any of our linemen are making an impact at all. Mangold is the only O-lineman I think has Pro Bowl ability. D-Brick has shown some improvement, but he's not the impact player you would expect of a #4 overall pick, and I don't think he ever will be. None of the other guys is better than average at best. I'd like to see more of Bender to find out if he can be a starter - otherwise the Jets need to look to add 2-3 new Olinemen in the offseason. The biggest problem on the Dline is Nose Tackle - and not one Jet fan didn't know this before the start of the season. Dwayne Robertson is not an NFL full time Nose - and his inability to control the line makes everything else fail. Ellis has become a steady veteran, but no more - and not what we'd hoped from a #1 pick. No other Dlineman looks NFL calibre. This also effect our Linebackers - although their poor tackling is no excuse. Basically, we are getting beat at the point of attack on both sides of the ball. This reminds me of the 70's when the Jets had the smallest lines in the NFL and regularly got pushed around by other teams. Enough finesse, we need some big strong studs on our lines if we hope to succeed...
I think dbrick can get there, he did a good job on osi, then turns around and does a great job on smith.. I mean what more can the kid do.... Hes going to get better, i was hard on him earlieir in the year but now ater the last couple weeks hes restored my confidence in him....
It's part of the reason the Jets are losing. The D-line being the larger of the two parts in my opinion. They put no pressure on opposing QB's. It's also the main reason the D sucks so bad...even David Barret would get off the hook sometimes if the D-line could so much as hurry an opposing QB. Agree on Robertson, as so many people have so many times before. I'm not convinced he'll be some kind of beast if we bring in a legit DT either, but I'm pretty sure he'll still be here so we'd find out. Coleman has been productive against the run at times, but nothing consistent. Ellis is getting old... I think they should address the D-line in the draft and look to sign FA talent for the O-line. They need a DT and a speed rusher ala J. Abe. Sad part is that any DT taken would likely be a project that won't show full potential for a few years.
Thats rather simplistic, and only half accurate. On the offensive side of the ball, the line,while not great, is not playing badly, excepting the fact that they are handicapped with Chad behind center. Put in Clemens, wait 2 or 3 weeks, till teams figure out that they cant just come up the field on him, and Jones will start averaging 100 yards a game, and time of posession will go up. The OL Problems are not Line problems, they are scheme problems. They are always facing 8. On the defensive side, this line was origanally built for speed around the edge. Which is fine for a 4 man front. But when you go to 3 you need more size, Kenyon Coleman is looking good, and Ellis while quiet, has not been bad. Dewayne plays good in spots, and then looks mediocre. You need exactly one player to fix the Dline. Someone big and strong to go between Dewayne and Coleman, with Ellis Rotating, add a Pass rushing OLB, and the line will be just fine. And Dont forget, because we are losing T.O.P. the second half starts to wear the D Down. Keep the ball a little longer, and the D will pick up, if not substantially.....
D Brick has to get better run blocking. The line is not as aggressive as I like. Where is Alex Gibbs? We need this guy.
This is not true, it took two downs to get 1 yard this last week, 3rd and 4th in the 1st quarter and we only got 1 yard and 3 inches. If you believe the coaching staff believes the o-line is good, ask them why they didn't run it up the gut 3 times against the eagles to win the game, but instead went to a finesse fad pattern. Has nothing to do with Chad in the Redzone, doesn't matter who the QB is, when you get in the redzone, there are always going to be 8 in the box. If you can't run it then, you are going to settle for fieldgoals.
Did you even read this before you posted it? 2nd and 1 against the eagles there was no 8 in the box. By virtue of Down and distance there are 11 in the box. The problem in short yardage has nothing, zero,zip,nada, to do with the OL. It's the supplemental package and play calling that sucks. When you need 1 yard, you need to get bigger up front. We have 3 useless TE's on the roster. When most good coaches HAVE to HAVE that one yard, you see extra tackles reporting as eligible, be it Offensive or Defensive, and you get a bigger body as the fullback. Parcells used to send Jumbo back in as a TE, Belichick varies his players, using particularly LB's.
I completely agree. I assume that everyone knows that the most inporatant parts of a football team are the lines. It all starts there, and without solid line play on both sides, you're fucked. I think one of the biggest problems is our failure to develop the players we bring in. You don't need 5 first rounders to have a good line, but you need coaches that can teach big strong guys the technique they need to excel, and we haven't done that. Still, he is not as much a prblem as many other guys. I am happy with Brick right now...
I am happy with D Brick also compared to the others, but that is something he has to work on. I think Kendall was a big loss because we had one side of the line solid.
Hobbes - I agree that the quarterback's lack of a threat on the deep ball handicaps our Oline. However, they do not seem to have the ability to fire out and make room for our runners. Yes, they will look better if we have a deep threat, but let's be honest, they are not a top Oline. I also agree the biggest problem on the entire defense is NT! That's why I wanted Haloti Ngata in the draft instead of D-Brick...a true wide body and disruptive force.
Yeah, the Jets are beat at the snap on most plays. It is a testament to our weak schedule so far (2007 results of our opponents have trended poorly) that the Jets have been in games late anyway. I've seen enough out of D'Brick to make me give him another year before I write him off as a potentially dominant player. He really just needs 15 solid pounds to get there. D-Rob is not any kind of NT. He literally cannot play the position. He looks like he's lining up in the middle of the formation and playing 3T tackle at this point. He's more effective when he's in the wide fronts with another tackle next to him and a linebacker on the line of scrimmage to his right. That of course is as close to the 3T tackle position as you'll get at the moment. As you point out Ellis is doing a 3-4 journeyman LDE's job. He's not creating a lot of impact but he's not a hole either. Parcells would have been thrilled to have Ellis at LDE in the fronts he ran as the journeymen there were not as good. I was just thinking this the other day. Today's Jets really remind me of the Jets circa 1975 or so, maybe 1976. Joe Willie could still unwind a beautiful deep spiral in those days but he rarely had time to do so and his declining skills and utter lack of mobility just accentuated the fallthroughs in other areas. People like to think that this Jets team is just a few players away from a championship run but in truth we are a few drafts away, and they need to be well-managed drafts. We've had two well managed drafts (2002 and 2006) in the last six seasons and if that rate continues we are just hosed.
I think he is just fine. I want better run-blocking out of him but that fact that he has done just fine protecting Chad since week 2 is enough to show that he is doing his job. O-line is as much feel, comfort, and savvyness as it is raw power, so he'll get bett if he has a desire to. With Brick, that's the one thing that worries me. Does he want to be the best, or just do good enough to not get shit after the game?
Yeah D'brick has been outstanding the entire year at LT. He's faced just as many great DE's this season as he did last..and this year he has been dominant in pass protection. If you think the OL is bad...imagine how bad it would be w/o him on the blindside. I've said over and over again...if he dominates in pass protection for 8-10 years...he'll be more than worth a 4th overall pick.He's on his way to doing that. The rest of the OL aside from mangold, is very shaky. But at least we have a young core to build around..and more help on the way(Bender). The DL needs a complete revamp..or a switch back to the 4-3...it is downright awful.
I Agree , D-Brick has done very good against some of the greatest Ends in football , gotta give em alot more credit.
O-line is attitude and scheme. We don't have either right now. The players that should have been pissed about the fade against philly was the o-line. I didn't see it.
d-rob can't draw double teams at all, he can't do much against one guy blocking him, that is the entire defense right there, everything falls apart when we send in our linebackers against offesive lineman, its pointless GIVE ME A BREAK WITH KENNY WATSON, HE LOOKED WAY TOO GOOD AGAINST US IT WAS PAINFUL
The D line not only lacks size, it lacks SPEED. I hate to say it, but our D has suffered tremendously since Abraham left. And anyone saying Bryan Thomas is an equal threat is just kidding themselves.
Our front 7 is horrible. We are undersize and have no speed. I can't even fault Mangini as a coach, I fault Mangini and Tannenbaum for not realizing that they had do so something more on both lines this offseason. I don't expect to build a great front 7 and great offensive line in 2 offseasons, but going into this season they had to look at the front 7 and say how is this going to work?
This is my biggest peeve and fear also. How did the Jets brain trust not see that they were going to get absolutely rolled by good teams and even have trouble competing against mediocre ones? Mangini says he watches a lot of film. I believe him on this. How could he get caught up in the whole "the 3-4 defense improved" thing in the second half of last season when in fact it was just the schedule becoming much softer at that point? The Jets had absolutely no reason to believe that they were going to be better on defense this year than they were last year without establishing an ability to stop the run. Where on earth did they think that was going to come from? The football fairy? On offense they not only did not draft or sign a competent offensive lineman at one of the three hole or near-hole positions on the line, they actually traded probably their third most competent lineman over a million dollar dispute that they had allowed to get publicly nasty, and then they signed a mediocre to poor right guard to a multi-year contract. Obviously I'm no expert on the NFL but these guys look like arsonists and saboteurs to me at this point. We're suddenly a terrible team and the Jets are back to looking like the Little Rascals going down hill fast in a sideways "fire engine" with no brakes.
