Its more of a winning record / get out of the basement kind of year when they say "win now" but its a bullshit term. Its the media essentially saying the Jets are putting the eggs in one basket with the FA signings, while not seeing how we are the 4th youngest team in the NFL, which makes us a team on the rise, not a team going for it all.
Quote: "...If Clemens isn't our guy now, then he never will be. He should be able to easily beat Pennington in camp and win the starting job. He has a better arm, had more success last year than Penny even though Coles and Cotchery were more healthy for Penny, and has had all the developmental time he needs to become the full time starter. This is it. Now is the time to turn over the reigns..." It seems to me that without rhyme or reason you are (a) throwing Chad under the bus, and (b) petulantly demanding that Kellen become a star or else! Neither of these QBs deserve to be treated as if they were the only offensive player on the field that had anything to do with the wins and losses in 07. Both these QBs were in different conditions but they were both subjected to play without an NFL-quality OL. Each of them reacted to this unmitigated disaster in his own way. But ultimately neither of them could overcome the failure of the OL. What will you Chad-haters have to say about the 08 Chad's suddenly new-found ability to throw passes that wideouts catch in the intermediate and deep routes? How will you Kellen-bashers explain the 08 Kellen's suddenly wise selection and hitting of the open man, right on the money? Wow, they just turned over a new leaf, huh? No, they just got behind an OL that was winning on the line of scrimmage as a rule instead of a seldom stunning exception.
Being given the time to throw is one thing, and one thing I agree with you on. But, and this is important--- a new and improved O-Line does not magically make a QB hit the window with any better accuracy, velocity, or ability to read a coverage pre-snap than before. Chad hasn't hit that closing window with a laser since 02. Unfortunately our franchise QB had numerous injuries, hampering what could have been a much better career. Kellen has that opportunity due to his youth. I think that him throwing at an open man's feet is more of a shell-shock mentality, but if he's continuing that habit- then its him, not the O-Line. Chad turning over a new leaf is improbable compared to Kellen developing into a viable QB for the next few years. An O-Line can help in the progression or revitalization of a career to a certain point, but the given talent in said QB must come directly from his brain, arm, and footwork- in that order- to see if he is capable of being an option to lead a team.
Quote: "...Chad hasn't hit that closing window with a laser since 02...." Actually, when Chad came in for Kellen during the second Pats game the announcer was astounded to point out that he hit several intermediate out patterns, and said he wasn't supposed to be able to do that any more. Accuracy and open WRs has a lot to do with whether the OL reinforces ALL aspects of the offensive strategy. We've been into this in detail before.
Quote: "...An O-Line can help in the progression or revitalization of a career to a certain point, but the given talent in said QB must come directly from his brain, arm, and footwork- in that order- to see if he is capable of being an option to lead a team...." I believe that Chad needs a little more time to throw because he uses his legs so much and because he uses that overhand delivery he took from Vinnie. He knows where to throw the ball if there's an open place. The WR's being open is a function of the play -- when a play fake is used it will only be respected if the running game is devastating the defense. Otherwise, the DBs will ignore it and glue themselves to the WR. So much of BS' offensive strategy is built on misdirection. Having Keller as an alternative will completely revise coverages on both Cotch and Coles. One on one those guys are really good at getting open. But neither one is magical at getting away from double teams which was the standard tactic in 07, when Baker was easily covered by a LB. By the same token, Kellen has no problem with a quick release -- he does need the recognition / decision time to locate and decide -- but the effectiveness of the play-fake and the alternative of Keller will also provide him with more wideout separation to work with. In each QB's case, an effective OL will deliver opportunity and time to take advantage of it, in my view.
Yes, Chad did make some good passes in that game - i'll chalk it up to extra adrenaline. :wink: But the Line doesn't make a QB's arm stronger, thats the point I was making.
Quote: "...But the Line doesn't make a QB's arm stronger, thats the point I was making...." There is no question that you're right about that. However, I think that throwing a forward pass has a lot more to do with how the QB uses his body (other than his arm) and whether the situation from which he throws is under control. When the OL does its job and enforces a successful running game, the pass plays usually give the QB a better chance to find WRs and hit them. He has time to see them. He has time to set his feet and bring his "core strength" to bear in the throw. I have heard a lot of "experts" talk about arms strength in the context that often times a QB has to throw "on the run", or "off his back foot", are sling it side arm to get around a rusher. Those improvisional "advantages" of a "strong arm" can seduce a QB into taking additional chances on the fly. The offensive strategy is designed to put each player in the best position possible for him to be successful -- this is not meant to put Favre out on the edge running for his life so he can do a "jump ball" over the head of a leaping linebacker to his waiting RB. Oftentimes, Ehrlacher will reach up and tip the ball (Favre underestimates how tall Erhlacher really is and what 'orangatang arms' he has) into his own hands for his OWN damned TD. The offense needs to overpower the defense to win. When they let the game get too close, so that victory relies on a lucky accident from the QB, the whole team suffers when "snake-eyes" shows up and Murphy's Law takes over.
That I have always believed, yet isn't talked about at all. I forget who said it, but they explained how Vinny Testaverde's cannon came more from his legs than his arm. It was the mechanics of stepping into the throw that it was using nothing but the arm. It's a problem I've had with Chad's mechanics, since he uses a stiff-legged approach, while i see guys like Manning and Brady get underneath the ball and use more of the "core strength" like you mentioned and hit a target with more velocity, than most QBs i've seen.
Quote: "...more of the "core strength" like you mentioned..." Yes, during off season last year, Chad was quoted a couple of times talking about how this was the first year in a while he had not had to rehab, and could concentrate on his "core strength" and his legs. Too bad he got that high ankle sprain so early on. But them's the breaks. At least he is aware of that short coming. Whether he can really do anything about it remains to be seen this year. However, I do believe that this OL will be his best chance in a long time to take advantage of whatever "core strength" he can muster.
The NY media has turned into a bunch of lazy writers. Nobody does any investigating. We sign some players that are not young, add them to a young team and we are now compared to the Redskins even though we are still young without cap problems.
Well then as the Pats learned so well last season unless you win the SB you are not a win now team. Actually I think Woody went for the big bucks this season because next season there is going to be one hell of a joint opening party for the new joint stadium & Woody wanted to be on as close as par as he could be to the NYGs
18-1 IS a LOSER that's true in their case! I see the definition for our "win now" being more like making the playoffs and possibly advancing to the second round. Anything beyond that would be ALL GRAVY!
The concept of a QB having to make a play while being bumped, moving to his left if he is right handed, moving backwards to aviod a rush doesn't even register with you as a normal part of NFL play even if you have a great OL. Without the QB being able to do that you can basically take away every SB trophy going back to the begining except for a handful. You don't win a tournement style playoff without haveing to make plays under duress no matter how good the OL is. The only way you win a SB with a QB incapable of making plays when uncomfortable is if you have a shut out stud HOF defense. No matter how good our OL is, we will face a D that pressures it. The refs will make us play a game that doesn't allow the OL to hold or extend the way they want to, we will face an overpowering physical menace and scheme and the QB will have to make plays when they aren't in perfect throwing position with a perfect lane. Risk is not impossible, games actually have to be won by great players making great plays.
I wish I'd seen this before, because this is just tragic. You can't mix that many foodstuff metaphors in one post. It's just wrong. First off, nobody buys fish wrap separately. It comes with fish. Second, fish don't really make crumbs, so what are these crumbs that would make me hold my nose? It's just all really, really, wrong and it confuses the younger posters.
Hey, Sundayjack, just because you don't fry fish, don't think they don't leave crumbs, Man. Catfish and red snapper both! There is also paper for sale labeled "fish wrap" and it has no smell yet. I didn't buy it when I saw it but I laughed and so I did remember it -- this way I could tell you about it.
