Interesting nugget to talk about... While I know Geno Smith is not our franchise QB do we really think a guy like Mariotta will be? I've heard a ton of arguments both pro and con. One thing that is absolutely true is we are a ton of talent away from being really competitive. The draft is coming up. Supposedly this is where our new GM is supposed to make his bread and butter. Having said all that, if Mariotta falls to us...as many draft mocks have happening...do we do a deal with the Philadelphia Eagles ala THIS report? Chip Kelly to trade up for Mariotta We could really use the numbers in the draft...an infusion of decent talent since we basically shit the bed in last years draft and wasted well over half our 12 picks. Thoughts...opinions?? What would you do? Personally, I take the deal. I think next year's crop of QB's are a little more to my liking than Mariotta. Winston isn't even on my radar due to his off the field issues. He's a MAJOR red flag in a city like NY.
1) would I? yes 2) Considering that it's still January I'd say that a) it's a smokescreen or b) just writer conjecture spreading over the interwebs
If Chip wants him that bad....he'll prolly jump over us in a trade. Me, I'd grab Mariotta. Don't like Winston, don't like his throwing motion..at all. Then there's the other 'issues' to boot
Probably this...but it sure is fun to talk about. And at Walt...I don't know...not sure what the trade formula would be...total compensation and all that...but outside of Tampa I don't know of who in the top 5 would want a QB. I really think the Titans think they have their man in Metty. Once out of the top 5 the trade compensation starts to come down significantly. If they feel they can wait until 6 they do it and save some scratch. Just spitballing.
If..and its a huge if, Mariota is there at 6, there is no way the Jets wouldn't take him. Not because he's looked at as good or anything, but can you imagine if they trade him and he becomes a star? It would be yet another thing that haunts Jet fans. With that said there is zero chance he is there when we pick. Too much pressure on teams to find that franchise QB and the top 2 teams picking both are in need of one. But if Im the Bucs I bend the Eagles over the coals. Kelly has already blown his hand on this potential trade.
According to the draft pick point value chart, the 6th pick = 1600pts. Eagles have the 20th pick = 850 pts To get our pick, Eagles will have to give us a combination of picks totalling 1600 points FYI, their first three picks = 1400, so if they gave us that, we still wouldn't be getting full value of the 6th pick overall. That being said, if we got the Eagles first three picks ( 20, 52 and 84) + somethimg else, it might be a good trade.
Interesting part of the story about Chip's interest is the history of teams who have gotten that big haul of draft picks. The Rams for RGIII haven't made the playoffs in 3 years. The Redskins (who picked up a boatload for the rights to Ricky Williams) didn't make the playoffs for 5 years. Doesn't mean it can't work, but quantity does not mean better quality.
I'm a Hawaii guy, but if an rg3 type deal or better is out there you have to take it. I'm high on Garrett Grayson so if we got him in the mids I'd be happy. However if no deal is on the table and mariota is there at 6 we take him, especially with gailey in place now.
I wouldn't ,If he is available to take you take him.Either of the QBs you take.Who are we to pass on a QB when we don't have one.
I'll expect the tradeup in one of two circumstances, either nobody is talking about it leading up to the draft or it is the only thing people are talking about. This is just early speculation.
Recent history shows that drafting a QB is a game of chance. Andrew Luck was the only sure pick at QB for the past... something like 10 years. My preference with this is to collect QBs, draft 1-2 every year, evaluate and keep the best until you hit your jackpot. So I would absolutely take 3-4 high picks with this deal. Neither Mariotta nor Winston are a sure bet. So draft 2 this year and 2 next year off of PHI's picks. IMO this way chances of striking gold are higher. Plus if Mariotta pans out, Giants will be pissed - added bonus. That said, I really doubt Eagles would trade up.
Beep me when Chip offers the bunch of 1sts and 2nds on a silver platter - till then, it ain't happening. And if he actually does - Jets had better snatch it so fast that Chip can't think again.
It's impossible to predict these things. Maccagnan could really like a particular player, Mariota included, and not be willing to move from that spot. Maybe he has his eyes on somebody else who he doesnt think he can get at pick number 20. My thought process on Mariota in particular is simple. If the Jets like Mariota, take him. I'm not the biggest fan of his but guys like Maccagnan get paid to do this and have way more information and tools available to them than we do.
http://www.ganggreennation.com/2015/1/18/7717183/new-york-jets-where-do-teams-find-quarterbacks New York Jets: Where Do Teams Find Quarterbacks? There is a lot of excitement around the hirings of Todd Bowles and Mike Maccagnan, and justifiably so. Both have a lot of potential in their new jobs. Will they be successful. Nobody knows for sure. A large degree of their success will undoubtedly come down to their ability to find a quarterback. I'm not sure it is true that a team necessarily needs a great quarterback to win in today's NFL, but it is almost impossible to build a consistent winner without a good quarterback. Despite Geno Smith's big Week 17 performance at Miami, he has not shown much to suggest he will be the answer at quarterback. Where do teams find their quarterbacks? I decided to take a look. For my cutoff point, I used ESPN's QBR stat. It isn't perfect, but it is an easy enough stat to understand. It rates quarterback performance on a scale between 1 and 100. I took the quarterbacks this season who had a QBR over 50 and enough passes to qualify with two exceptions. I added Carson Palmer, who did not have enough passes to qualify based on both his play this season and his track record. I also added Alex Smith who had a 49.3, just below. Here are how their teams acquired them: Aaron Rogers Draft - 1st Round Ben Roethlisberger Draft - 1st Round Eli Manning* Draft - 1st Round Joe Flacco Draft - 1st Round Matt Ryan Draft - 1st Round Philip Rivers* Draft - 1st Round Andrew Luck Draft - 1st Round Ryan Tannehill Draft - 1st Round Cam Newton Draft - 1st Round Matthew Stafford Draft - 1st Round Teddy Bridgewater Draft - 1st Round Colin Kaepernick Draft - 2nd Round Andy Dalton Draft - 2nd Round Russell Wilson Draft - 3rd Round Nick Foles Draft - 3rd Round Tom Brady Draft - 6th Round Jay Cutler Trade Alex Smith Trade Carson Palmer Trade Tony Romo Undrafted Free Agent Peyton Manning Unrestricted Free Agent Drew Brees Unrestricted Free Agent Mark Sanchez Unrestricted Free Agent Ryan Fitzpatrick Unrestricted Free Agent Are there any lessons to take from this? There's a pretty big one. 11 of the 24 were drafted by their current team in the first round. Dalton and Kaepernick were picked at the top of the second round. Of the seven players who were acquired by trade or free agency, five were first rounders. A seventh, Brees, was picked with the 32nd pick. When he was drafted there were only 31 teams in the league so he was a second round pick. Today the 32nd pick is a first rounder. 19 of the 24 were originally picked in the top 40 of the Draft. Wilson and Foles were third rounders. Still want to wait for the third day? Only Brady, Romo, and Fitzpatrick didn't go before the fourth round. There is a school of thought that the Jets should wait until the middle rounds to take a quarterback. I don't necessarily disagree with taking a shot on somebody, but it probably isn't because that player is going to step in and become a great starter. The NFL scouts can't say with a high degree of certainty whether a quarterback will pan out. One only needs to see how many quarterback busts there are in the first round. It does, however, seem like they are pretty good at eliminating the guys who really can't play. If they don't think you're good enough to merit a first or early second round pick, the odds seem very stacked against you. What about the elite franchise quarterbacks, though? While the list above is a group of players on the fringes of good quarterback play, it isn't perfect. I mean Mark Sanchez made the cut. Let's cut the list down from 24 to the top 12. Aaron Rodgers Draft - 1st Round Ben Roethlisberger Draft - 1st Round Eli Manning* Draft - 1st Round Joe Flacco Draft - 1st Round Matt Ryan Draft - 1st Round Philip Rivers* Draft - 1st Round Andrew Luck Draft - 1st Round Russell Wilson Draft - 3rd Round Tom Brady Draft - 6th Round Tony Romo Undrafted Free Agent Peyton Manning Unrestricted Free Agent Drew Brees Unrestricted Free Agent There we go. Now doesn't that look like a real list of the top quarterbacks in the league? Seven of these twelve were first round picks who have spent their careers with one team. You really need to draft one of these quarterbacks too. They don't become available. Why would anybody make a top quarterback available. There is only one reason, to replace a franchise quarterback with a younger, also elite quarterback. Manning and Brees are the only guys on this list to change teams, and that is exactly what happened. Their original teams had the ability to replace them with another quarterback on this list. The Colts moved from Manning to Luck, and Chargers moved from Brees to Rivers. Last night Seth.P wrote a great FanPost talking about some of the dangers when it comes to taking a quarterback early. He made a lot of great points, and I strongly encourage you to read it. There is a flip side, though. It is true that teams should not take a quarterback in the first round for the sake of taking a quarterback. You do, however, need a good quarterback in the NFL, and the first round seems to be the spot to find the best ones. *Eli Manning was drafted by the Chargers. Rivers was drafted by the Giants. The two were then traded for each other on draft day. For the purposes of this piece, they are considered homegrown.
You never do that deal. You take the fucking QB and you sit him for a year and then you ride him for the next 15 years to multiple Super Bowls. All the talent you can accumulate means nothing without a franchise QB. With the way the rules have favored offense, hoping to build a consistent winner by building a Ravens like defense and a game manager QB is a pipe dream. Get the QB. For once since 1969. And trust that the rest of your drafts produces a lot more talent than the Terry Bradway/Mike Tannenbaum/John Idzik regimes have produced. Like a normal NFL franchise. _
Winston has all the makings of a franchise QB. If you want one you get the #1 overall pick and make it happen. Mariotta is nothing more than a lottery ticket.
They would probably leap ahead of us, because we could take Mariota too so we would have to get a lot back.
Mariota is a QB. There's usually a premium on those kind of deals, especially when the team trading the QB pick needs a QB. If Kelly really wants Mariota he doesn't want him if he falls to the 6, he wants him at whatever price he has to pay short of giving up his firstborn child. So he'll go to the Bucs first, unless the Bucs make it clear they are taking Winston. In that case there's no point in approaching them. Then he'll go to the Titans and over them an overload deal for the 2. Something better than the RGIII deal is my guess. If the Titans say no and Mariota is still there on the 3, an unlikely proposition, he'll go to the Jaguars and overload with them. The odds on Mariota getting down to the 6 if Kelly really wants him are zero. One of the teams before the Jets will take the overload offer or Mariota and the issue will be finished. If Kelly doesn't have to have Mariota but wouldn't mind if he fell into his lap and if Mariota is not that hot a prospect going into the draft then yes, it's possible Mariota is still there on the 6 and he makes the kind of offer you suggested. The argument for Kelly wanting Mariota can be seen in two different lights. Kelly left Oregon after Mariota's very impressive freshman season. That's not normally what a high profile coach will do if he thinks he has a great player playing for him. He'll stay at home and enjoy the sweet fruit of success with his young star and then leave when the star leaves. So the "Kelly loves Mariota" angle isn't guaranteed at all. He walked away from him once already. On the other hand the Eagles made a really strong offer to Kelly in terms of compensation and they told him he'd be running his offense in the NFL. Maybe the two inducements were just so strong that he'd have walked away from a young Peyton Manning also. The argument can also be seen two ways from a performance standpoint. Position one says that Kelly has gotten a lot of production out of the Eagles offense with pocket QB's running his system. He doesn't need a mobile QB to make the thing work and the Eagles success in scoring points the last two seasons underscores that. Position two says that Kelly hasn't been completely satisfied with either QB to date and that he may be thinking it is time to put some mobility into the equation because the NFL is catching up to the limitations of his system when a pocket QB is running it. This would explain the complete lack of turnovers last year as the NFL was frantically trying to catch up and then the large number this year from two different QB's. Maybe his offense needs a QB that forces the defense to maintain a spy on the QB as well as do all the other things it needs to do to contain the damage. If position two is in play then Kelly will probably try to acquire a QB with some mobility this off-season somehow. Then a trade up for Mariota, particularly if Kelly really likes his chances in the NFL, becomes a very real possibility.
