Ty Law pretty much single handedly beat Peyton Manning a couple of years. You can't downplay that because maybe they don't get by the Colts those years and things are different. Was he the "key" to the Pats success no but they always have at least one very good corner. It used to be Law and now it's Samuel.
I think Revis is going to be a shutdown corner for years to come, which is why it wouldnt surprise me that in true Jets fashion he leaves as a free agent when he's really hitting his prime.
If you aren't happy with the Revis and Harris picks, then you'll never be happy with any pick the Jets make. Tell us what 4 players you would have preferred to have taken in the positions the Jets originally picked. This is just being negative for the sake of being negative.
You really go in depth with your analysis sometimes...I think you should apply for the GM job when they fire Tanny next week. What 4 guys? Harris and....*blank* for scenario 2? Could be anybody as long as it was...anybody? Now I know why you hate Mangini. If he could lay plans and work with hindsight like you could...he'd be BB + Parcells + Walsh + Lombardi + Landry + Coryell + Brown + Madden + Gibbs + whoever else you want in there. Why would I or any other Jets fan want 4 random guys when we got 2 of the 5 best rookies?
There is something to be said for trading down and adding quality, young depth, which is the way to win in the NFL, but the quality of this year's draft class was quite questionable. I believe New England cut most of their many draft picks this season and Arizona cut a third round pick. While I normally would avoid putting all your eggs in a small basket as the Jets did this year, the situation definitely called for it. -X-
Ty Law was a CRUCIAL game changing piece to that pat's team a few years back, now Asante Samuel is a big piece. Cornerback is also become a much bigger piece THESE days because of how much more the rules protect the recievers etc
I think Revis and Ross are both going to be very good players, while Hall's future isn't as certain. Ross seemed like a similar corner, but not as tough against the run, and more fragile. Revis looks to be more consistent, rarely getting beat, despite not having much of a pass-rush. Also, let's not forget when looking at the numbers, Ross got to play a game against Chad Pennington; Revis didn't. That's two gimme INTs Ross got that Revis never had a chance to make... Just saying :grin:
oh christ, you just sent this thread into a worm hole that will collapse upon itself shortly, but you already knew that ... edit: btw, is Ross going to play this week or does his shoulder still sore?
Neither Law nor Samuel have been key to the Patriot's chances. The key has been a very strong front 7 and great QB play in tight games. To prove the point: Ty Law was considered to be one of the best CB's in football in 2004. He went down week 7 against the Steelers with a broken foot and did not play again that season. In his absence the Patriots defense actually improved, holding 5 teams including the Colts to single digits in the next 12 games and winning a super bowl. Last season against the Colts in the playoffs New England's pass rush broke down in the second half and Asante Samuel could do nothing to keep Peyton Manning from scoring at will as the Colts came back from a huge deficit to beat the Patriots in the 4th quarter. Cornerbacks just aren't that impactful unless everything else is in place also, and even then they don't have the kind of impact that makes them indispensible. That's why people like Champ Bailey and Deion Sanders and Ty Law move around as much as they have. It's not a key position. It's certainly not a position to break the bank in terms of value to staff.
So Ty Law physically and literally removing Marvin Harrison from the game in 04 (or was it 05 cant remember) had nothing to do with that victory?
Those players didn't fall into their laps. The brilliance behind the Patriots' drafting strategy is that they not only identified core-building talent well in the draft, but that when players didn't fall to them, they traded out of their current spots either down or into the next season to wait for more core-building talent to fall for them. What they didn't do is panic when a division rival traded for an explosive wideout and trade up twice on day one. I'm very excited about the play of Harris and Revis, but that doesn't change the fact that we took an overall step backward to get them.
If so, why do people who buld teams for a living belive they are? http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=jc-parcellshistory121907&prov=yhoo&type=lgns You talk a good game about others not knowing waht they are talking about, but it would seem at least one of the games greats disagrees with you. The FO has a ways to go to fix that Offensive line, and the jurys still out on Clemens, but I belive we have a very good corner in Revis. Perhaps your negitive bias towards the current staff has somethign to do with it. Hopefully we have a good season this year so your bi-polar fandom can swing back to its happy mood.
Are you serious? In todays NFL the shutdown CB is one of the top 5 most valuable properties in the game. You're right though...we should have gotten one of the elite DE/OLBs last year like....iunno....or an elite 3-4 DL prospect man like...Carriker who was taken a pick before our jump...or one of the elite QBs like...iunno....
It must have been in 2003, since Law was hurt in 2004 and with the Jets in 2005. Peyton Manning had real trouble in the playoffs right up until last season. He looked terrible against the Jets in 2002 and the Pats in 2003 and the Pats (no Law) in 2004. That was more a Peyton Manning thing than anything else and right up until the Super Bowl last year you heard people talking about his mediocre play in the playoffs. Let me turn the question back on you: if Ty Law is so valuable and was so instrumental in beating Peyton Manning in 2003 and if Peyton Manning was the primary hurdle through which the Patriots had to go to win Super Bowls, then why did Belichik let him go when he became a free agent? Why did Belichik choose to sign Brady and Richard Seymour to long-term contracts and let Law go? Why did he choose to sign Adalius Thomas and Rosevelt Colvin to long-term contracts as free agents while he was letting people like Lawyer Milloy and Ty Law go? Why did the Jets not turn the presence of Ty Law into a saving grace in their bad season in 2005 instead of collapsing as if he was not even on the field? Why have the Chiefs just gone 4-12 with Ty Law at CB? Cornerbacks just are not that impactful a position. Safeties are actually more impactful, based on how NFL teams are drafting these days. Teams are actually taking safeties in the top 6 or 8 pretty regularly but cornerbacks are slipping down to the double-digit picks.
I'm pretty sure the Patriots traded for Moss after we drafted both players. For anyone saying moving up to get them was a bad choice, I understand the reasons you don't like trading up, but as many others have pointed out it was a weak draft class so who would you have drafted in the original spots? Anyone can follow a cheat sheet on how to do something, but making the right moves in the right circumstances is much more difficult. It's not a science, it's an art. If the FO saw a weak draft class and moved accordingly, I can't blame them.
Peyton Manning had trouble in the playoffs because Ty Law was grabbing his best receiver and deep threat and carrying him out of bounds. 2) This argument is so retarded, you know why Bellichek let him go. Because he was coming off an injury and was getting old, the same reason he was so inneffective for us. He had Asante Samuel coming up anyway, you see him letting him go? And now your wondering why he's not helping out the chiefs? HE'S ANCIENT. Cornerbacks lose their legs fast.
The Patriots and Packers had visited Moss for a workout the day before, and when a team like the Pats makes a move on a player like Moss, I don't care how much Belichick likes to contain information, leaks happen. The trade was ANNOUNCED halfway through day one of the draft. The Jets knew about Moss before it was announced. If you don't understand that then you're jaded. The FO saw a weak draft class and traded their entire 1st day for 2 players, that's the opposite direction from a rebuilding effort. Revis could end up being Ty Law and it won't change the fact that the team fell flat on it's face for neglecting the lines. And you can't just build offensive and defensive lines with FA stopgaps. If they didn't see the talent in the draft last season they could have traded picks for future picks, and we would be stockpiled this season.
I'm going to guess the Pats let him go because Law hit his 30's, was expensive, and injured? You've got to be kidding me with that Chiefs line...why even bother making the genius implication that they went 4-12 BECAUSE they overvalued the CB position? Considering that they were 14th in PA and 31st in PS...how was their defense (and their CBs) even the problem? You're obviously smart...cause you're making weak arguments somehow sound legit...but the analysis in your posts is just so...off. It literally took me two seconds to look up that the Chiefs were 31st in PS. BTW: The safety position has jumped in value because good ones can play well at the LOS (for run support and blitzes) OR cover deep. Considering the pass happiness of todays NFL, having versatility like that is huge. Even then, more CBs have been drafted in the top 10 than safeties in recent years...Newman...Robinson...Jammer...Hall...Rolle...Rogers...Pacman...vs. Taylor, Landry, Whitner, Huff, and Roy Williams PLUS Huff was drafted as and played CB until they decided to move him back to FS. Why am I doing so much research to trump things you made up? I need my job back.
Why are NFL teams not drafting cornerbacks in the top 5 then? Where are the shutdown corners in the NFL playing these days? Champ Bailey - Den (7-9) Ty Law - KC (4-12) Chris McAlister - Bal (4-12) Terrence McGee - Buf (7-9) Antrell Rolle - Ari (8-8) Asante Samuel - NE (16-0) Marcus Trufant - Sea (10-6) I probably left a few people off who should be included but that's a good look at who people are not throwing at much and unhappy when they do.
