http://forums.theganggreen.com/showthread.php?t=6544 Also, there was an article on the official Jets website about two months ago saying that the CS would try to convert Thomas into OLB.
Barton, Vilma, Kassell, and Hobson. I don't know why people are thinking that Kassell is not a good player, he is. He had over 100 tackles two years ago along side with Keith Bullock. I think Kassell will be a run-stopping MLB.
They said he'd be tried out at LB? Who said this? I can't find any articles, I can't find any quotes from Mangini about this. I would love for him to become a good OLB, but the bottom line is that no one knows if he can play the position. And honestly I can't find anything that says the front office is moving him to linebacker.
You are a joke, Poey Porter was drafted out of college as a DE, Ted Bruschi was drafted out of college as a DT, and both made the transistion perfect to LB in 3-4 defenses. You have lil to no knowledge about College or NFL football which you made very obvious. If you want me to list more players I can. NOTE these guys didnt play their respected positions in college.
Please continue the personal attacks. Joey Porter was drafted to be an outside 3-4 linebacker. He was expected to play that position. Most of his first season he spent playing special teams and learning the position. Just because Joey Porter was able to make the transition from college DE to NFL OLB in a 3-4 doesn't mean that Bryan Thomas will. Bryan Thomas has been in the NFL for 4 years and has never proven to be anything more then a backup who is solid against the run. I don't think I've ever seen him beat a tackle around the edge which is what an OLB in a 3-4 needs to do. Do you really want to compare Bruschi to Bryan Thomas? I'm glad that you've been able to show that players can make the transition from down lineman to linebacker. But lets keep in mind just because other players have made the transition doesn't mean that Bryan Thomas will. Also, Thomas didn't make the transition after he was drafted, he spent 4 years as a down lineman. And still no one has shown me a quote from Mangini where he says he's going to try and make Thomas an OLB. I for one think he might be better off bulking up and becoming a DE.
At around 265 hes got ideal 34 OLB size. And superb triangle numbers to go along with it. But hed have to bulk up some 40 pounds to play 34 DE.
I agree that on paper (his speed, size) he could make a nice OLB. Whether or not he has the skills to do it is another thing. I think his football skills are more suited for a down lineman then a pass rushing OLB. He could be play DE in a 3-4 at 280-290. If I recall he played some DT in the past as well even thought he was undersized. The coaching staff will explore all options and figure out what they think is the best roll for each player. It's difficult to try and guess what they are going to do because the defense is going to have multiple fronts fronts. It's not like with herm where they usually played a 4-3 and didn't really rotate players other then for rest on the D-line.
Can we pleeeeeease stop with the back and forth "you're a joke" comments. Just because opinions differ doesn't make a person a joke. jeez. Take it easy.
For our LBs, I like OLB--Bryan Thomas--has the speed to get some sacks and go sideline-to-sideline, only problem might be the tackling but that's not too important for 3-4 OLBs MLB--Vilma--people say hes too small, but he said that when we drafted him MLB--Kassell--up and coming player, small too, but is a good tackler and good up-and-coming player. Schlegel can play on 2-down runs. OLB--Barton--one of the leaders on the defense who can play ILB or OLB in a 3-4
Several points in no particular order... -Mangini will "try" to convert Thomas into a 3-4 OLB. -Thomas has never played the OLB position before. -To date Thomas has not been able to use his great 40 time to be a dominant edge rusher. IMO he is still very fast (i've seen walk a couple Rbs 20-30 yards down the field) but lacks explosiveness. In his defense, he hasn't had the opportunity to play at the weight he was drafted which was 260-265lbs. Due to poor nutritioning, he lost a lot of weight and barely played his rookie year and in subsequent years his playing weight was closer to 275-280lbs. Maybe he'll show the explosiveness he showed in college by switching positions and losing 10-15lbs. -In the very few intances when Thomas has had to drop in coverage he has done a decent job, better than Abe even (that's not saying much, though). Also, the ROLB in a 3-4 very rarely drops in coverage anyway. -My depth chart would be: ROLB-Thomas, Johnson RILB-Vilma, Hobson, LILB-Barton, Kassel, Schlegel LOLB-Chatham -We had the ideal 3-4 ROLB in Abe and traded him away.
Right now my guess this is what the depth chart looks like. OLB Thomas ILB Barton, Kassell, Shlegal ILB Vilma, Kassell, Shlegal OLB Chatham, Hobson If we truly are planning on moving to a 3-4 the possibility of picking up another OLB before camp is probably pretty good. But the failure to take a OLB or address the NT situation outside the 7th round makes me believe the Jets will mainly be a 4-3 team this year. Which means most likley our LB's will be Barton, Vilma and Hobson. Not much to be excited about there either but they still look better than our 3-4 LB's.
i agree completely...barton really should be able to play olb in the 3-4 i think that kassell and hobson, possibly schlegal will battle it out for the other ilb spot with kassell taking it.....chatham will be the primary backup at both olb spots
Yes, the front office has said that both Chatham and Thomas will be experimental at the outside linebacker position. Thomas has never been asked to drop into coverage and since he doesn't rush straight up field every play like Abraham I don't see how he will be such a liability in coverage. I didn't compare Suggs or Ware to Thomas if you could learn to read. I said that neither dropped into coverage in the 3-4 yet are still great at their position because they can rush the passer and defend the run equally as well. You don't a guy who can cover at the weakside outside linebacker position. You need someone to drop into a small zone and track down ball carriers in the flats, if you knew anything about a 3-4. For the most part Thomas has struggled early on as a lot of pass rushing lineman do (Abraham - 4.5 sacks 1st year), but he's played well the past two years which should make the coaching staff think that's he's more than garbage as you seem to put it. He's bounced around and has been playing two different positions on the line as well as just subbing in for a breather every now in then other than when Abraham was hurt. He had 2.5 sacks in zero starts and a sack in three starts when playing last year. His skills are well documented and it's clear that he's certainly athletic enough to play in a 3-4 with his very fleet footed speed. With a good coach he should be able to make the adjustment and he will have more motivation not playing for Fat Teddy anymore.
When did the front office say this? I can't find any quotes. I haven't heard the front office comment on anyone other then Pennington. The media has written stories about ideas like this, but no one has quoted Mangini. Thanks for the heads up, I'm gonna start working on reading, it's really been a struggle for me up to this point. Now that you've pointed it out i'm gonna work on it. The big difference between Suggs and Ware vs. Thomas is that both Suggs and Ware have proven they can get pressure on the qb and Thomas has never done it. Thomas has been on the field plenty of reps and has consistently shown that he is not a disruptive pass rusher. He is very good against the run, in fact he's much better then Suggs or Ware. In four years if he had any ability to get to the qb he would have been on the field more. It's not like Abraham never got hurt. Once again I know plenty about the 3-4 and the weakside linebacker on passing plays will either blitz, drop into a zone or have man coverage on a running back. So far Bryan thomas has shown that he's not a good pass rusher and no one has any idea if he can drop into coverage, whether it's zone or man. I can deal with a weakside pass rusher in a 3-4 having weak coverage skills if he's consistently disrupting the offense with his pass rushing ability. But no one has any idea if Bryan Thomas can play linebacker. In 4 years he has not developed into a decent defensive end so now your assuming that changing his position and giving him a new coaching staff that he's going to become a good player? The odds are not in his favor. I hope i'm wrong and he does become a solid player but I just don't see it. He's been a bust for 4 yours, most guys in the nfl don't even get 4 years to prove themselves. He looks great on paper, good size, speed but that doesn't translate into a good football player. I hope you're aware that fat teddy hasn't been his coach for the last 2 years. Maybe you can't read to well, might went to work on that.
I think you are in for a rude awakening. We have an O-line with 2, maybe 3 starters that have actually played together, 2 loosely projected starters that are rookies... a brand-new offensive scheme... a brand-new defensive scheme... 2 rookie coordinators and a rookie HC... practically all new position coaches... and we're in the AFC East. Make no mistake, we're going to lose a lot of games this year. We are most assuredly rebuilding.
Also why did they let Mark Brown go he is with Arizona now, instead of signing all these undrafted rookies they should have brought him back. One of our best players last year.
